Why are “Christians” in a club and buying a round of drinks? If Christians are out to dinner and have to pay a gratuity tax this should not be compared to tithing. Everything belongs to God. Is God really concerned about the tithe or is man concerned about our tithe?

Scripture: Micah 6:6-8 6Wherewith shall I come before the LORD, and bow myself before the high God? shall I come before him with burnt offerings, with calves of a year old? 7Will the LORD be pleased with thousands of rams, or with ten thousands of rivers of oil? shall I give my firstborn for my transgression, the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul? 8He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?

@ Louise, Judge not lest you be judged!! Quotations around CHRISTIANS??? Perhaps the scripture reference should’ve pointed to the place in the Bible where it says CHRISTIANS shouldn’t be in a club or buying a round of drinks!

I personally do believe God is concerned about the tithe, and we as men are concerned as it relates to having resources to continue to reach people with the Gospel and having what a church requires to function from day to day.

In direct response to the blog Dr. Ed, I’m a faithful tither and have seen the benefits firsthand! I even know people who aren’t saved who tithe and reap the rewards on the principle of tithing alone! Keep up the good work!

I agree that sometimes we get caught up in the worldly way of things, as with the gratuities we pay when out. For me personally, the tithe to the church or whoever is feeding me is an act of worship to the Lord for providing for me. Its not so much about what we do as it is about what is in our hearts and showing our gratitude for what the Lord is doing for and in us. And giving back to God and His Kingdom is just telling Him with my actions and with my heart that I am thankful that He is continually providing those things I need, while also being obedient to His Word. While some get in a huff about tithing, they forget that it takes money to live in this world, God is the Creator of all things and money in and of itself is not evil. We are commissioned to go into all the World and preach the Gospel to the lost… it takes money to do that and it is a great privilege to be able to help spread His love and His Word! It goes back to the scriptures that tell us to love others as we also love ourselves!

Personally I don’t think that you can compare tithing to tipping or gratuity. If that’s the case, we ordered a $2500 meal, or 10% of whatever our income may be. Sometimes I think the church uses this, instead of teaching this for finances. Tithing is important, but I think another instance needs to be brought up to make this point, or the word of God valid.

I have often wondered whether tithing was meant for everybody, or just for members of the church. I attend the same church quite often, but I am not a member. Every time I attend I give at least 50 dollars to the church. I don’t look at it as tithing. I give because I enjoy my time there. When I dine out, the tip is reflective of the service. Tipping is not a law. They get what they give. If I am at a church where there is no sign of Jehovah God in the house, they too will not get a tip.

I think the concept inwhich this topic is taken is important. We always question the man or women of God when it comes to tithing but we never question the restaurants for charging gratuity and not only that, we pay it. Look at it from a point of view where, we are being served in both places (the restaurant and at church). However, when we get sick or in trouble we can’t go back to the restaurant and seek help can we????

Malachi 3:10 reads, “Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it”. The tithe opens the window, the offering determines how much is poured out. We don’t pay tithe for man. It is a worship to God and a principle. What the church do with the tithe has nothing to do with us. We are to follow the scripture as it is laid out. Just like anything else, it take MONEY to finance the kingdom. The world won’t finance the things of God, so we must do it. The world not concerned about reaching the lost, we must do it. We can’t reach the lost if we don’t have RESOURCES. When we pay the tithe, it has to be released. If we are in turmoil on what the tithe is used for then it has not been released. Seed does not produce until it is in the ground. If we pay tithe grudgingly, its not released. We have to get pass our spiritual minded selves and become spiritual sensitive to the things of God.

I enjoyed reading the blogs. In my opinion titheing is very beneficial. Before giving I was askinvg God for a way and help. I am a living witness that much is given to those that give back. Following this method with consistency you will enjoy the wonderful opportunities of life. I wish you all the Best. Be Blessed!

If the anointing is attached to it then I’m abiding by it….and I believe that if the anointing abides in you you’re a thither….1 John 2:27

What is the tithe? Simply stated, it is a tenth part, especially as offered to God. In the Bible, the 1st example tithing you’ll find in Gen 14 where Melchizedek blessed Abraham 1st, that’s key (read it your own time). In turn, Abraham blessed Melchizedek and gave him a tenth of all. In Hebrew 7:3 describes him as a person without father, without mother, without genealogy, having neither beginning of days nor end of life, but made like the Son of God, he remains a priest perpetually. Melchizedek symbolizes Jesus himself. Tithing is not a commandment, or an obligation. You will not be condemned if you don’t tithe. But again, when you look at how tithing began, it wasn’t until Abraham was blessed 1st when he tithed. To tithe or to tip is a choice. If you get top of the line service from a waiter or waitress, they’re worthy of a good tip. If you’re in a church you see yourself growing, receiving good sound word that is edifying, you’re spiritual life has gone to another level, you are not necessarily limited to 10%, you can tithe 15% or 20%. If you’re finances are hurting, start at 4% or 5% and work your way up. It should be done with joy because after all God loves a cheerful giver. I think I typed too much, just want to share some info with you.

@ PJ, very good point!

And KP, that wasn’t too much typing! He asked us for our feedback and yours was very interesting!

I like this blog! I’m anxious to see what other responses there will be…..

We must teach God’s people of the blessing of God in giving. teach Pressed down, shaken, running over. ….sow sparingly…reap sparingly…bountifully reap bountifully… . ….teach on cheerful givers…teach that their money is given unto God. Sowing and reaping…Teach God give seed to the sower Ask them why don’t you have seed to sow? Teach them to seek out the scriptures on giving in good faith. Teach on what God gave and how he continues to give. This would empower people to give more than 10%.

If we want the blessing of God then we must do what will bring the blessing to us.

Then we would never have to be subject to guilt if we go out to dinner because we have given God his portion.

We can also take another view. Some people may not tithe because they are not seeing the return (promises, fruit, etc),and its weakening their faith. So shall we also examine the soil in which they plant??

We can also ask how is the spiritual food in comparison to the restuarant food. Food can make us fat. Are the people of God getting fat on his word?

What impartation is being made into the people that will change their lives? They will give…..because the spirit of giving will come upon them.

Just somethings to think about…intercession perhaps
Agape!

With no disrespect to anyone, I believe that tithing is a good thing, I also think the church needs support tithing and offerings can help supply the church with what they need to maintain the ministry, where I have a problem is (SOME) pastors, create a picture that in order to hear from GOD or be Blessed by God you must give your tithes or offerings or God will not bless you, now that creates a mode of conviction to make people give, I agree with (KP’s)comment, I would like to support any church that I have been feed,or that’s doing good things in there community, but not feel forced in to doing it, I respect the man or woman of God that ask directly for support of their ministry. but again my concern is when some ministries make it seem they hold the key to the confession booth! An God will only see you, through them. Many people I’ve spoken with rather give freely than feel convicted.

Excellent Blog!
Blessings

Jesus went to the party and He made more wine, He literally hung out with the folks. We have to give in whatever capacity that might be. God know our hearts.

Jesus went to the party and He made ore wine. He literally hung out with the folks. Tithing we all have to give. You want a roof over your head, food to eat, clothing, air conditioning and income for other resources. You wouldn’t want God’s house to go lacking would you?

I totally agree with God’s Chosen Lady, the response came straight from the word of God. You can not add or take away from God’s word. It is right no matter who doesn’t believe it, because anything else is our own thoughts and not God’s. The New Living Translation states it this way. Malachi 3:8-10 reads, Should people cheat God? Yet you have cheated me! But you ask, “What do you mean? When did we ever cheat you?’ “You have cheated me of the tithes and offerings due me. You are under a curse, for your whole nation has been cheating me. Bring all the tithes into the storehouse so there will be enough food in the temple. If you do,” says the Lord Almighty, “I will open the windows of heaven for you. I will pour out a blessing so great you won’t have enough room to take it in! Try it! Let me prove it to you!

Tip or Tithe? We tip not based on it being mandatory, but by the level of service we recieve. If we compare a tip to a tithe based on the level of service, then what if we felt as though we did not get anything out of the church service? Should we still tithe because I don’t tip for bad service. Tithing comes in more ways than just giving money. Time, information, any part of gain can be considered a tithe. If I am a farmer does not my 10 perent of crops given to feed the hungry be considered my tithe? Did Moses pay his tithe? Did King Solomon pay his tithe? Did Jesus pay his tithe or did he collect the tithe after his teachings or sermons? Could it be that we have allowed Paganism to infiltrate todays Christian Church and confuse our understanding of scripture?

On another note, there are some who think the tithe is an investment and expect a return. I am aware that there are those who teach 10 and 100 fold on your giving, however, what about the sin in ones life. If I am the biggest giver/tither and also the biggest sinner, should I still expect the increase? Is there anything that can hinder my expectation or as some would call my blessing? What pastor/teacher/doctor/bishop/reverend/evangelist/televangelist/prophet/prophetess/first lady/king or queen do you know who teaches that? Have we fogotten that God knows our hearts?

Read Malachi 3:8-10 Will a man rob God? We are supposed to pay our tithes and offering to God first (before taxes). Your tithes is what you owe God and God wll open up the windows of heaven and pour out a blessing that there shall not be room enough to receive it. Be blessed and tithe! Because anything and everything you do for Christ will last. May God bless everyone reading this to tithe regularly so that you may be blessed by God.

Dr Ed, I think I clearly understand your poser but unfortunately some brethren are taking-off on the analogy of the club and Dinner thingy and missing out on the subtle message in the post.

@All Dr Montgomery has not suggested you substitute tip for tithe(not even because both start with “t” or has to do with giving) but His message is that 10% is rather too libral a requirement for tithe compared with 18% or so that you have to tip for a couple of drinks or food etc….

Pastor Please I think you can help our understanding here but I personally think your analogy is clearly a “home run” rather than “a curve ball”.

God bless you sir!

Tithe and Tip!!!!! God Bless my brothers and sisters of the Kingdom of God! I would like to extend our understanding about tithing by taking us to the next verse in Malachi 3:11 “And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts.” I believe that this verse denotes God’s protection over our possessions! I also believe that apart from obedience to God about the principle of tithing, it is the way the He uses to get blessings to us. Please be encouraged brothers and sisters that God is not trying to take anything from us but trying to get the overflow to us! He can and will bless us in a way that the 90% will go much farther than what we can ever do with the 100%!!!!!

The Bottom line is love. If I Love God I will not have a problem with obeying His word. I don’t have enough money to give my God who only commands at minimum that I bring a lousy 10% of my income to support a place where I have the audacity to come and want to eat, get prayer, get delivered,Healed, and demons casted out, study the word, expect the pastor to watch for my soul, baptize me, commune me, pay the lights, gas, have air conditioning, pay the musicians, buy chairs, lecturns, lamps, Bibles, Baptismal pools, cut the grass, provide transportation for the needy, feed the homeless and go to the nations just to name a few things that happen with the little 10% that many don’t really want to give. It is horrendous yet I continue to call myself a follower of Christ. That is a mockery and I often think about it. I am a pastor who has planted my own church. In 8 years I have never taken a dime from the ministry yet I watch many buy dinner for 25.00+ and put a dollar in the offering for Bible Study. God does know the heart and until His children stop basing their giving on a feeling we will never really experience the MORE that our Father wants us to have. The over and abundant God that we serve would not do us justice if He blessed us exceedingly when in our heart we don’t Love Him nor His work enough to give FREELY and Bountifully. We cannot let money hang us up it is only paper. Seek ye first the Kingdom of God and His righteousness and watch what He will truly add to you. It’s guaranteed! Check the Love Level! Is it High or Low?
Hmm Food for thought!

@ Larry Odey I am glad you pointed that out, I think most of us got caught up on the club and drink portion of the message and forgort the purpose of the post.

God looks at your heart, simply put, Jesus came and gave us grace with simply two commandments to love God with all your heart, soul and being and to love your neighbor as yourself. When we do that 10% is not really a factor because our heart is for God and our hearts are for those around us. Wherever our heart is that’s where our money will go……

p.s. I do have an issue with a restaurant automatically adding 18% to my bill especially when I believe I did not receive good service, but on the other hand if I received good service I may want to give more than 18%, that’s why I love the freedom of giving as “I purpose in my heart”

I, feel tithing is a part of ministry, and it is a blessing when you can tithe,a lot of times people speak harshly to members,concerning tithing. our pastor teaches us your offering is just as important.I always think of the widows mite, because she gave what she had and was blessed more than the others. God knows your heart,and thats what he looks at the heart, just give thanks,plant the seed.that you have,and watch God.

Wow! Dr. Montgomery you really hit a nerve. I have been on both sides of the fence with tithing or not tithing. That’s why I decided to become a cheerful giver and servant. I was taught that if you give God 10% of your income that He would bless you and open up the windows of Heaven and pour you ut a blessing that you would not have room to receive. This teaching tends to make one think that they can buy blessings.

I fully understand and am very much aware that it takes finances to keep the lights, gas and supplies for the house of God operating and helping those in need. I believe in supporting the ministry where you are being fed not only with finances but with your time and talent/skills and service as well. I realize and know that The earth is the LORD’s, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein. Everything belongs to God.

My problem is with this scripture being taught that all you have to do is give God 10% of your income and you will be blessed. God hates sin and it doe’s not matter whether you tithe or give 10%, 20% or 100% of your income if you have not given your heart to God all your given does not matter.

another problem that I have is the “Pay to Play” that go on in some of our churches. As long as the person is giving their tithe they can function in any office or position regardless of their life style.

I know and see people who give their tithe and offerings at church and go home to a house where their water has been shut off or their lights turned off. Thank God that I was able to be of help in both situations.
I also know people who pay their tithes and offering yet bounce checks for their bills at home.

To: Huh-Really? I apologize if you thought that I was being judgemental. I too am a sinner saved my Grace and I do not judge people… – you said that you know people who are not saved that use the tithing princple. Read Asaph’s song (Psalms 73)

Dr. Montgomery, help me better understand Malachi’s message was it to all people or was it directed at the Priest and Levites / Leaders who were in charge of offering sacrifices on behalf of the people?

People of God need to be taught correctly and not to pick and choose verses from the Bible for their convenience or gain.

again, I apologize for any offence.

I really enjoyed reading all of the responses. Each comment I read gave great points. I believe we should do what is in our hearts to do. The bible speaks of 10% but if you are led to give more, give more and sometimes we have to step out on faith and give more if we are looking for more. The word is true if you give little that is what you will receive. So give as much as you can so you can receive MUCH. REAPING AND SOWING!!!! BE BLESSED EVERYONE.

In respect to everyone that gives a tithe don’t stop!
In respect to those who go all out, who’s to judge? Now, in respect to those who have no understanding on tithing its only 10%. Even if all you have to give is the time you pray for others. In other understanding don’t laugh when you don’t under estimate others way of tithing. With the bartenders laughing at you because they still get paid no matter if you tip or not.

Hi; Well look like a few head stacks were blew, God said there is a time and place for everything.He Never said what things,I belive as long as their done in decent ordered and moderation, its all right with God ;than it is well with me,You see the waiter in the club may have 6-8-or ten children at home. and we will never no. Same as is judgeing –is this person a Christain or non Christain –We will never no -The Bible says a person must also get paid for there labor accordly.I understand what your saying about tittles.But until the understanding sinks in about its meaning ;and purpose their will be lack.

Louise, thank God for all that you had to say on this subject of tithing,God has put the same thing in my spirit. Jesus taught giving!! I also believe that it matters about how we do what we do for God!! it has to come out of a PURE PLace.
Why don’t we hear more about Malachi one and two? Thoes two chapters has a lot to say!!!

Cool analogy Pastor! It amazes me the controversy that always follows this subject, and any subject pertaining to money and the house of God. Well… it actually shouldn’t amaze me, seeing that this was a subject that repeatedly called for reprimand in the Word.

For me personally, this issue becomes one of obedience, as with all things we should be doing as a child of God. I can make a sacrifice in my giving to church, and in that moment, I am choosing to do it, on my own terms, in determining what amount I am going to sacrifice in giving out of my income.

When I, however, pay my tithes, I am not determining the amount, I am clearly obeying a law and principle of God, out of my willingness to follow His will, conforming my will in this matter to His.

Obedience is the greater move in this instance, being greater than sacrifice, because it removes my own final approval on the amount (self) and conforms to the amount (10%) that God Himself, in His All Knowingness (Omniscience) said would be appropriate! It can’t get any more trust worthy than that in terms of a set amount, since He set it!

Restaurants now legally require a gratuity at a percentage… there is a law in place somewhere that passed that makes it legal for them to require it, and many times they just add it in. We obey it most of the time at the percentage required, we should do the same with church. Sadly, we will honor business legislation over God’s laws and principles. We will tip out of pride so we don’t look cheap to others. It’s fairly simple to me, just tithe out of obedience, to a law and principle that God decided was a good way to take care of His house, and give to His house out of the New Testament commandment to love Him with everything in you, and to love your neighbor as yourself. We all need money, the churches do too.

I think alot of you may have gotten what Dr. ED was asking out of context. Have you forgotten that before you see your check the goverment has already taken 28 to 30 percent out of your money before you even see your net, then you stop to a store or service station to get gas or food or something to drink and you are taxed again. God ask for 10% He deserves that and more. I have often stated to my husband while out to dinner do I give this server more than God requires. But I too tip according to the service I receive and sometimes I give more just to be a blessing to that person along with a card inviting them where I worship. When doing this some have showed up to Church. Like many have said God loves a cheerful giver, it could be a penny if you give it grudgingly then you are not releasing it from your heart and God is not pleased. I agree with some of the things G. Marie Carroll was stating about the Church having to function in all the things it provide on 10%. You know what people it’s time we gave God a raise and we often expect to get on our jobs. I show God through my tithing how I thank Him for His many Blessings. Another thing most people are not tithing the correct way any how You are to tithe on the Gross of your check the number that is before anything is taken out many tithe on the net so you have already robbed God. He states your first fruits that means the whole not the left over. Also, being blessed by giving does not mean you will always get money in return your health, family, children, job and other things positive in your life could be your Blessing. Always remember God word speaks for itself it needs no help or correction. Love you my Christian Brothers and Sisters live by the Word of God and BE BLESSED.

KP you are on Target! Tithing was never a part of the Abrahamic covenant.
There is no longer an obligation to support the Levites and Priests as they are no longer working in the Temple;In general regular charity is a commandment that is expected of everyone and it teaches us the very important lesson that the monies we control has been entrusted to us by Our Almighty Father.
We should not make the mistake amd assume that if a person works for his money then he has “earned” it and it belongs to him without any conditions before hand. Money or Assets have been granted to us by Our Father and we must prove ourselves worthy of being the recipients of it. Therefore, we take some of it and GIVE to other areas that may use it to benefit those in need of it. ‘We Share’ out of obedience!
Genesis chapter fourteen we read about a war between kings of Sodom, Gomorrah with two ally kings that were defeated and taken prisoner. The victors took the property of the Kings, took Lot, women and children captive. When Abraham heard about this he and his men went after them and defeated the kings. Abraham then brought back Lot and all the possessions as well as the women and other people. See: Genesis 14:16.
18Then Melchizedek king of Salem brought out bread and wine. He was priest of God Most High, 19and he blessed Abram, saying, “Blessed be Abram by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth. 20And blessed be God Most High, who delivered your enemies into your hand.” Then Abram gave him a tenth of everything. Gen: 14:18,The reason Abraham gave a tenth was because of God’s deliverance from his enemies. ( A Thank You offering).

Blessing and Peace
Nubia

Should we give more to the church? YES absolutely… But maybe the church should ask why are people not willing to “Tip” or give a tenth, as no ones “tithes” according to scripture - but that’s for later….

People give or spend money according to what they value the most…. 

There are those who are willing to give their lives and everything in their lives for the Gospel. While others are looking for fire insurance and want all the blessings of God, but our relationship with God is much more valuable then that, when we understand who we are in Christ and our inheritance that is provided by him.

Yes, money is needed for ministry, but it does not take money to share with someone what God has done in our lives. For many, our salvation was something we experienced in the natural, before we really appreciate the spiritual benefits. However, when we realize that every part of our salvation is a gift we freely received by faith in Jesus and he is the only reason we have what we have, we will stop trying to merit the blessings of God and start giving with a pure heart towards the things of Gods from a disposition of love.

Now as for tithing, I was amazed at what I did not know about the subject when I began to “study” it out for myself. It was not until I was willing to weigh what is taught in the balance of the word and rightly dividing it, that the light of truth allowed me to see clearly, that money was never given as a tithe.  And that the teaching on tithing has so abused the people in the church, that it causes many to hold in suspicion the church motives for preaching the gospel.  

When we state that the book of Malachi says…. “ye have robbed me of tithes and offerings..” we due an injustice to the prophet and his message and drag the people from the freedom delivered by the cross and salvation by grace, back to a life of performance under the law. In doing so, we now become a debtor to the whole law and have fallen from grace according to the Apostle Paul.
 
Many are still trying to put new wine into an old wineskin… But the real question is, if the Apostle Paul condemned those who mandated circumcision, and this as well as tithing was started in Abraham, how will the church be judge for still requiring “tithing” of money but freedom from every other old covenant law?

If people are not giving to the church liberally and freely as they have purposed in their heart and prospered by God, they have yet to experience the love of God in such a way, that they would give themselves first, as the Macedonia’s did.  Then the question becomes, is the church communicating the Gospel that first allows this love to be experienced by the believer rather than tainting it, looking for a tip or a tenth?

I just saying…

Frankly, I don’t think this is about tithing. So this whole discussion is a red herring and a waste of time. Why not grow up and put the cards on the table. It is painfully obvious that the Pastor feels not enough money is coming into the church. If I read between the lines enough from Sister Saundra’s messages they may also feel the church participation isn’t where they would like it to be either. Not as clear about that, but I’m 100% sure that money must be low.
It can’t be just about tithing because that could be easily remedied. According to what the Pastor teaches, tithing is a command of God…something to be obeyed. In so doing the tither will be blessed. If this was solely a lack of tithing “thing” then it could be swiftly addressed in one short sermon. “If you are not tithing, that is why you are having all of the trouble you are having. There is no need for you to ask for prayer and we won’t waste our time praying for you. Don’t call asking for help because we won’t give it to you. You are in disobedience and you need to correct yourself.” One sermon. That is all that is needed and then move on. If those people stay and continue to not tithe, then they are the ones who will suffer for their disobedience. Yet the Pastor still continues to preach to the obedient tithers as well as the disbodient about tithing. Why? Doesn’t that fall under the category “preaching to the choir” Maybe he is concerned about the corporate body being blessed. Maybe he feels that if there are a few disobedient “members” then the whole church is effected and can’t thrive at the level God wants. Well again that is simply rectified by calling the disobedient out and casting them out. If he believes that tithing is a command of God and that the disobedience of some pertaining to that command is hindering the whole church he doesn’t need to waste valuable time “teaching” it over and over. It is only right for him to cast them out. It isn’t that they don’t know. Tithing is mentioned every Sunday. So he has a responsibility to kick them out of the gathering. Then he and the obedient church members can go on with the work of the kingdom. No I believe this is not a tithing issue, but rather a need or want for more money to come in from all. If that is the case then he should not mask it in pointless discussions like this seeking to make peope feel guilty about what else they may be doing with their money. Simply, put the cards on the table. If there is a financial need, call a meeting of the members and let it all out. “We need this much money to keep things going. We are only getting this much money. We need people to give a little more.” That way people can see what is going on. They can decide if these are worthy expenditures. Maybe they may ask to cut some things out. Maybe they may come to a better understanding of what is going on and will try to give a little more. It would just be helpful to be straight forward about the matter and not try to make it a God and blessing thing. Just like your household has monthly bills so does the local church building. People get that. Just as your family has to work together within a budget, so does the church family. That is not hard to understand. Just put it out before the people on a Tuesday, Thursday or Saturday meeting. That way the Sunday worship service can be used for worship. And the pulpit can be used for delivering relevant and current, words from the Father.
Not “pleading” and “guilting”.
There is so much going on in the world that is calling for a vibrant, sober and vigilent church. We had a judge just declare that defining marriage as only a union between one male and one female is unconstitutional and seeks to make the uion of same sex couples equal and acceptable. We have many of our young boys and girls falling prey to that confusion and not knowing how or even whether they should resist it. We have black institutions and “leaders” trying to stir up the racism issue and gullible black people using that so called racism as an excuse to sherk responsibility for their ill behavior or lack of motivation. This keeps them always seeing themselves as victims and oppressed. (a permanent lower class. they even believe the uneducated, non english speaking illegal alien is a threat to them because they are “taking jobs away” from them as if all black people can do is wash dishes, clean hotels and cut grass.) We even saw, recently, a man use supposed racism as an excuse to kill people. The church remained silent We have a president who many black “Christians” helped to put in office who is doing all he can to alienate Christians and Christian organizations as he promotes and reaches out to Islam and muslims, as well as radical gay activists all in the name of tolerance and campaigning. And what is the church doing? Talking about tithing and getting blessed. It is time to grow up. Get the focus off of ourselves and back on God who is concerned about a lost and dying world. Lets hear about the kingdom. The Blood. The Soon Coming King. Lets hear about dying to self and sacrifice. What about the Judgement of this world. Let hear some prophetic words for today. I’m not talking about” some vague good thing is going to happen for a $29 seed.” Forget about trying to manipulate God. We should be passed praying for food on the table, shoes on our feet and parking spaces. Rather what are the marching plans for the soldiers engaged in this spiritual battle waged against the saints? What is the word to the world and the president and other leaders of the nations?Where are our visionaries and prophets. I don’t mean these folks running around with business cards that say prophet and prophetess. I’m not talking about these new pseudo “christian” celebraties traveling around on the christian curcuit from conference to conference finding themselves in the tabloids just as much as the hollywood celebrities, yet adding no one new into the kingdom. I’m talking about true prophets that come to deliver the Word of God and go just as quickly…like the Lone Ranger. Not staying long enough for you to even get to know their name, practically. We all need to repent, fall on our faces and ask God to work on us. Notice I include myself in that.

Someone stated earlier that you can give more than 10% as tithe. The definition for tithe is the 10th part, therefore anything past the 10th is a vry nice offering.
God does ask us to tithe and he goes on to say if we do not we are cursed with a curse. I think when any christian try to find a way pass that concept, he or she does not fear God as we should. I am afraid not to tithe, even when I feel like I can’t afford to tithe, I conclude that I cant afford not to.
18% after dinner? All I have to say is to each his on. I will tip but it will always be under 10%!!!!!
I am thankful that for 26 years I have been a tither and I will continue until Christ return.

These responses are getting really interesting. So many different views and opinions. I DO agree that the blog subject has been taken WAY too literally and at times the message has been lost.

Louise – again, the first question of your initial post is what came across as judgemental. In reference to PSALMS 73, what exactly are you trying to point out? I’ve read it, just trying to understand the correlation on your part.

Michael Moore – I can’t speak for Dr. Montgomery, but I think if all it boiled down to was money, then I think he WOULD just say that. However, having been under his leadership for many, many years, I TRULY believe that his point is to draw awareness and teach people about the principle of tithing and how it affects our lives. But at the end of the day, tithing is still a CHOICE that we all have to make, so it would be wrong of him (and definitely controversial) to “cast out” people who haven’t chosen to tithe.

If you go to ALC, you’d know that many of the people who walk through the door are younger Christians, or in many cases aren’t saved at all so for them, it’s going to take a while to teach them about the tithe and its importance. And those of us who know it already should understand that.

The reality is if churches, not just ALC but any church, had a greater overall percentage of consistent tithers and givers, it’d be enough to do what needs to be done. So it really IS two-fold.

As for services – I don’t know how much more relevant and current Dr. Montgomery’s messages could get!! I used those words EXACTLY when telling others about his sermons recently. WORSHIP (music and the message) has been HIGH and EXPLOSIVE!!!

Is tithe money? If you look up in the OT, tithe is clearly not money but food (Lev 27:33). When the Law of Moses was established, it was mandatory for the Israelites to tithe, a tithe was a tax paid to the Levites, there work was basically in the Church or Temple, the didn’t have regular jobs, they lived merely on the tithe. When you read Mal 1:1 (NLT) it says: “This is the message that the LORD gave to Israel through the prophet Malachi”. The Lord gave specifically a word to Malachi for the Israelites. The Law of Moses was still in tact, it was still valid, and a law was broken if you didn’t tithe back then. Many churches base the tithe on that verse alone but don’t interpret acurately that during those times, it was mandatory to tithe. We no longer live by the Law of Moses. Why didn’t Jesus ever instruct his disciples about the tithe? That’s a question of reflection. It’s not that I don’t believe in honoring God in giving, because I find it a great joy when God puts me in a position to bless someone whether it is giving someone a check, a new suit, whatever. What we need to teach people that God would never want us to do anything for Him out of obligation. He gives us that freedom to decide, it’s up to us to do what the Holy Spirit puts in our heart to do. Yes, support your church and your pastor especially if they’ve blessed you and you’re growing in the congregation where you attend. Don’t be stingy, but be a grateful giver.

Read Malachi Chapter 3, all of it! It’s a law, it’s the truth straight from the Bible and if you don’t have a job or any resources coming in, tithe when you do! I expect everything God promise according to his word and thats why I am a believer and a tither! I love it Pastor and all I don’t understand I will, because of my obidience!

To Liz. Read Col 2:13 & 14 it says 13) When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions, 14) having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. OK, in the Greek Translation, “certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us” talks specifically about the Law of Moses and in that category of the Law of Moses includes the tithe. When Jesus was nailed to the cross, that Law was no longer existent. Tithing is NOT a law! We have to remember that the Bible was not written in English or Spanish, we need to study the original translation to know the full meaning of what the Word says.

huh really- It is very obvious this is about money. The pastor makes mention about giving more in some way all the time. Again, I wish he would just come straight out and say it and stop vailing it in these so called “principles and teachings”
In the Bible, tithing was not treated as a principle or a teaching that needed a lot of thought. You don’t see Paul, Peter, John or anyone preaching or teaching it. Paul briefly talked about giving not tithing when reminding a congregation of a one time offering they had promised to give to another congregation. They went about preaching Christ and Him crucified. They preached the Kingdom of God. They preached relationship with the Holy Spirit. They preached the making of disciples. They preached being sober and vigilent and aware of the enemy. They preached dying to self and sacrifice. They were not all consumed about “how to gain wealth”, “how to get your needs met” ” how to use God as a means to an end” “how to have all that the world has to offer and yet still be a christian” When those become your goals then tithing becomes something that you must be taught to get it to “work”. That is a prosperity, charismatic invention. Based on the many different responses and reactions to the “teaching” of tithing from folk who have been under the leadership of the pastor for many years as yourself the teaching is not coming through because abundant life does not seem to be on one accord pertaining to it.
It is simple-either God says tithe or He doesn’t. As long as I have heard the pastor “teach” on tithe, he has said that the tithe belongs to God. he has taught that the tithe is a command of God. He has not taught that it is a choice. Now if he has a congregation that is in such discord regarding what he is teaching is a basic and important tenant of the faith, he has an obligation to get things right otherwise all that is being done is done in vain. If tithing is a command of God then everyone who claims to be a follower of Jesus should be doing it. If not then they should be restricted from the fellowship. If it isn’t that important then lets move on to more relevant things. You sight new believers and even the unsaved. First new believers are never the problem. New believers are usually more on fire than people who have been under the message for years and years. All you have to tell a new believer is God says do it and they are there. The unsaved should not be taken into consideration when it comes to the assembly of the saints. the coming together of ourselves is not for the unsaved so we shouldn’t be wasting time considering them. It is when you go into the world and make disciples that the unsaved become important. The assembly is all about God. Worshipping HIm and ministering to Him and having him respond with currrent and relevant word. No not more promises or methods of how to tap into his “gusher” but rather who should we anoint to go where for the preaching of the kingdom. Why is there no mention of this latest ruling on same sex marriage. Why is there no mention of the rise of Islam, especially among black males. Why is there no mention of blacks uing the race card and racism and seeing themselves as blacks and victims before seeing themselves as Followers of Christ. When was the last message about walking in discernment of the Holy Spirit in order to be a witness ready with the right word for the time. In case you haven’t noticed the world is not being effected by the church. The Bible says that the unbeliever stood in awe of the believers. Today, especially in the black community the unbeliever laughs at and ridicules the church. The church has become secularized. The messages are more like self help, motivational speeches rather than rhema from God. We have become selfish seeking after how to get ours and using God as some sort of tool or rabbits foot to achieve it. Shame on us. Forget the “tithe”. We need to Surrender “All” Die to “Self” come out of the World. Redicate to God and listen to the Holy Spirit. Lets get back on one accord with the Father and realize the reason Jesus died and was raised from the dead. Lets get about our Father’s business. When we do that…money will come. More importantly…power will come. Signs and wonders will come. God will come.

Michael Moore, that was deep. That’s all I have to say. WOW!

Michael Moore, I’m sure there ARE preachers who are speaking about same sex marriage, the rise of Islam, etc. If the message that’s being taught at ALC isn’t for you, it’s cool! There’s an open door policy. I pray you find the perfect fit for what you’re looking for in a church.

I once saw a pastor on TV (will not same name or church) who once encouraged the TV Viewers to send their tithes to his ministry & I was blown away by that. I can’t believe how far some pastors (not all) have come as to encourage the TV audience to do that, then we wonder why it is that many members or church goers do not give in the churches. I truly believe that when a genuine calling from God comes for any individual whether it is to sing, or to be a pastor, or whatever ministry it is, that God will not let the righteous to be forsaken nor his seed to beg bread (Psalms 37:25). GOD IS NOT CRAZY FOLKS!! I also spoke to a young man who told me that he didn’t want to step foot in a church because he went to one and saw a pastor driving a Bentley and he thought that was a little extreme. I, for one, having nothing against any pastor driving any car, that’s not my issue. My issue is that sometimes when it comes to giving, spontaneous messages or “freestyle” messages on giving could take a twist that is not even in the Bible. Again, I believe in honoring God with your wealth like it says in Proverbs 3:9. Think of a charity that you might give you (United Way, March of Dimes) etc. What is the reason that we tend to donate to those charities? Most likely it’s because we believe that they are doing good in the community. The same concept applies to the churches. If you find that your church is doing great things in the community on top of that you’ve grown & matured in your spiritual life, than it wouldn’t hurt to contribute to that church. At least, I would. Me personally, I don’t have an issue to give 10% to the church, I’ve never had that issue, because I do it joyfully. What I don’t like is when minsiters teach and say that “WE ARE ROBBING GOD” if we don’t tithe that bothers me because that is far from the truth. His word says in Haggai 2:8 `The silver is Mine and the gold is Mine,’ declares the LORD of hosts. How can we rob something of God that already belongs to Him? Another question of reflection. This has been a great blog, keep it coming folks!

Michael Moore, WOW!!!!! Let GOD use you!!

Huh-Really-I find it a little ironic that you were very concerned for the new believer and even the unsaved when I suggested that the pastor should cast out those who were in direct and defiant, disobedience to a tenant that he teaches is a command of God. Joshua did it with Achan and his family(he had them killed). Yet you have no problem showing me the door(or reminding me there is a door that I should use) simply because I asked questions.
You suggest I go find someplace where the message is more for me. You’ve missed my whole point. It is not about me.
There is a lost and dead world out there. There is a real enemy out there raging war. I’m just asking is ALC’s message equipping people to be effective soldiers in this war. Is ALC’s message equipping people to effectively reach those lost and dead souls. Is ALC’s message equipping people to be ready to present Jesus to an unchurched world who doesn’t know, believe or respect the Bible; a people who already have the trappings of the world and are not looking for a “blessing.” Is ALC’s message equipping people to be ready to witness to that muslim who is willing to blow himself up for Allah? I can almost guarantee you he won’t be moved by your sowing and reaping, tithing and blessing message. Is ALC’s message equipping people to reach the jewish person who just needs to see that Jesus is the messiah? Is ALC’s message equipping people to witness to the man who wants to marry another man or who is simply dealing with homosexuality? There are a lot of parents killing their children. Many of them black parents either through abortion(pre birth murder) or murdering them in horrific ways after birth. Could this be a result of demons? Is ALC’s message equipping the people to be able to discern if someone is posessed and how to react if they are. I am not looking for a church where I will fit in perfectly. I am not looking for anything. I am suggesting, though, that there are people out there in need. They are in need of a relevant word. They are in need of someone to spiritually scratch them where they itch. They are the ones looking. The question is if they should come to us will they find what they are in need of?

Wowee. Well, in regard to the initial blog post, and in an effort to stay within the subject, following the given train of thought that presented opportunity for response to a specific subject and example, without bias, or a preconceived attitude that would suggest taking issue with anyone out of personal disappointment, I’d just like to say that I think anyone being honest would prefer the 18% over the 10%. Tithe, gratuity, whatever the classification, the math doesn’t change. You can do more with 18% than you can with !0%. I don’t see any secret encoded message in any of that. Pretty straight forward to me.

Where’s the irony?? I was and still am concerned about the unsaved and new believers. We obviously just don’t agree on what information is given to them and HOW it should be given to them. And I’m okay with that. I “showed you the door” because clearly you aren’t in agreement with the message, so it was a reminder that you have a choice of where you go to worship. It IS about you. Not selfishly, but where we choose to worship starts with US making a decision and going somewhere where our spirits are in agreement with the shepherd.

You didn’t “simply ask questions”. You started by saying that this whole discussion is a waste of time, but this is someone else’s blog that you’ve chosen to read and comment on. That someone is a person I love and respect, and have chosen to be under his leadership for many years. I personally feel as though the messages DO equip me to deal with many things, including ministering to broken people.

And to really be clear, discussing the tithe and offering is NOT all Dr. Montgomery speaks about. Get last Sunday’s message on UNDERSTANDING.

I agree to disagree with you, Michael Moore. Getting back to the subject of the blog, I’m reiterating that I am a tither and see the effects of it in my life on a daily basis!

Happy Wednesday everyone!

All of what you said would make for a good sermon Mr. Moore. With all the different opinions/interpretations from the saved or unsaved, it would make a sinner reading this blog for the first time wonder if Christians are on one accord. Are we reading the same bibles and recieving the same understanding? Anytime any saint or sinner compares worldly (tip) to biblical (tithe) it sends a loud and clear message to followers and would be followers: Is the World following the Church or Is the Church following the World? God’s Word never changes, and His Word is true, but yet we as Christians or so called Christians seem to come with many different interpretations on this subject of tithing as well as many others. Is there not a right one that God gave? It’s as though we are having a church fight but because we call ourselves christians, no one wants to admit to throwing the first punch out of fear of being labeled a judge or judging. What amazes me is that some of us want to live under the Masonic law of Moses while some want to live under Grace and yet still others want to live under both as it relates to tithing. God is not a God of confusion, but yet it seems as though His people are. I wonder if your Pastor asked, how do you know you are saved, how many different interpretations would he get? If tithing struck a nerve, then that question would surely strike the entire nervous system. People perish for lack of???????????? In all your getting, get????????????. Just as christians should be able to answer these, they should be able to answer the tithing question or maybe not.

Thank God! Now can we all just release our inginuity in some other blogs too?

“We Speak Different
Languages”

“We Come From Different
Cultures”

“We Keep Different
Traditions”

“No Matter What or Who We are, You Are Not Responsible for the Past, But
You Are For the Future.”
—By ???

Tithe and Pray!!! Within those wishes are equal rights that have nothing else but neglect of the economy not being down but allowing everyone to adjust to being on the same playing field. “Same level”, if you need to quote the PREACHER. Furthermore, when entering into his courts rejoice and give praise; not ridicule of how you accused someone of acting because you have only MISSED YOUR BLESSING.
I’ve enjoyed the time you have to write down everything in your head, but listen to who you enjoy instead of trying to break down the throne with negativity. PRAISE HIM IN ALL HIS GLORY AND HE SHALL DIRECT THY PATHS. LET’S GO!!!

My bretheren and the fellows And the pimps n the pulpit God doesn’t want the tithes he wants your obedience. Any fool can pay tithes, that is those who don’t have the proper atitude towards giving, like Cain in genesis 4 it takes a God loving Christian to be obedient.

The bible says it, I believe it, and that settled it